From Rock Bottom to Real Estate Success: Logan Fullmer's Journey of Resilience and Empowerment

After losing a million-dollar inheritance to a lifestyle of addiction, Logan Fullmer found himself at rock bottom, questioning his future. Determined to rewrite his story, he cleaned up his life and ventured into the oil industry, only to discover that he was destined for something beyond traditional employment. Logan’s journey into real estate began with a humble start—door-knocking and strategic investments—and has now evolved into a thriving venture. Join us as Logan shares his powerful transformation, highlighting the pivotal land investment that reshaped his financial landscape and reignited his belief in self-made success.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Logan Fullmer's Real Estate Success
• 10:45 Building Confidence for Self-Employment
• 16:21 Embracing Risk and Self-Development
• 22:48 Distressed Property Acquisition Strategy
• 34:10 Overcoming Addiction to Achieve Success
• 42:27 Balancing Success and Personal Satisfaction
• 55:04 Building a Strong Leadership Team
• 59:53 Real Estate Investment Success Strategies
• 1:04:31 Real Estate Syndication Investment Strategy

Transcript

00:00 - Hope (Announcement)
From oil fields to multi-million dollar deals, Logan Fulmer's journey is anything but ordinary. In this episode of the Property Perspective, host Jesse Burrell sits down with Logan to unpack how he turned rock bottom into rocket fuel, built a powerhouse real estate team and carved out a niche, flipping the dirtiest deals most investors wouldn't touch, From hidden gems to billion dollar deals. This is the Property Perspective, where seasoned real estate pros reveal how they spot value, others miss and industry disruptors share the unconventional strategies reshaping real estate. Now here are your hosts. 

00:37 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
What is going on everyone. Welcome back to another episode of the Property Perspective. My name is Jesse Burrell, one of the co-hosts of the show, and this is basically a podcast about how I talk to badass people inside the real estate space and they tell me their crazy journeys. I have a good friend of mine. He is one of the few that pushes me, impresses me, motivates me and always makes me want to be better. Logan Fulmer what's up? Buddy, my dog, how we doing Good to see you. 

01:10
You as well, I have a lot to unpack today. You have truly an incredible and a unique journey and you are one of the few people on my end that really you go hard. You still go hard, like you still go hard, and sometimes, when I think that I'm feeling myself and I'm doing great, I look at what you're doing and how you're always pushing and I can't really to really unpack a lot of you know what you have going on and what keeps you so motivated. So, logan, let's just talk about a little bit of who you are. Give the audience a quick intro on Logan. 

01:48 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Okay, sweet. Well, Jesse, first I'll start off by saying thanks for the kind words, and I've said it before, I don't know that I say it enough. They're right back at you. There are times in my business where you don't even realize how much you affected it. Specifically, when I came back from Phoenix the first time, I remember I was just like I'm just not doing enough, I just need to do double, and I literally could see about a third growth in the next couple quarters by just saying I have to do more, turn everything up a bit, and I'm like it's that fucking simple. But strangely enough, that was motivated by spending time with you and your people. Like that little thing made me millions of dollars, so I'll be forever indebted to you. 

02:27 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, tell the audience just a little bit about yourself and where you're at today

02:34 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
43 years old, live in San Antonio, Texas, went to college, went to the oil field and just kind of got into real estate. Wanted to make more money, became a business owner. So today I've got 20 people in my office lawyer, private investigator and a genealogist. I've got a CPA as one of the partners and we go through several hundred transactions a year. In distressed real estate I've got about 20 million in pipeline value and then in land development about 90 to 100 million in pipeline. Right now 20 people in the office. We just keep hammering. 

03:11 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That is insane. I'm actually an investor in one of your deals. So when I say I think Logan's special, I definitely believe in the operators that him and Bill are, and you know I'll put my money where my mouth is and hopefully I get the returns that that you seek. But let's go all the way back. You know, to the beginning and you know, with the property perspective podcast I really want to talk about. You know the journey and we're. I'm talking to you today for a reason You're obviously uncommon among the uncommon. You've done incredible things. But let's talk about that first deal. How long did it take you to get your first deal? What actually got you from the oil fields to real estate? Let's talk about that very beginning part. 

04:00 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I'll rewind just a little bit because it'll help you understand why me doing that mattered. I inherited about a million bucks from my aunt and grandmother collectively years before then and I was young, immature drugs, alcohol, bad lifestyle and I burned through it in about three years. And at that you know, yeah, like mid-20s burning through that that quickly, that's a lot. And I realized like when I went and got a job in the oil field I'd kind of gotten clean and sober and all right. Things are clear to me today. But when I started working I was making around a hundred grand, 80 to 150 grand during my time in the oil field, and I just remember thinking it'll take me 10 years after taxes to save up what I blew and I don't even get living expense out of this. I was so disheartened I knew I had to figure out some other way to make more money. And you know I did, like everybody Googling, looking around and I couldn't find the answer. And this was over 10, 11 years ago. 

04:53 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
We didn't have quite so much on YouTube and all that, nothing, nothing, because I got in about 12 years ago. It was like 2013, 2014. There was nothing there. It was like 2013, 2014. There is nothing. There's. Like you know, I was lucky enough to kind of hear about Sean Terry but I didn't understand what wholesaling was, and that was, you know, very early on. I'm like I didn't know how property is for sale without it being on the MLS. I was so lost. I was like what is going on here, you know? But yeah, continue on, continue. 

05:22 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
So I wasn't even aware of the MLS. I just went, looked up the tax records and started knocking on doors and asking people to buy property and I'd saved a couple hundred grand over the last couple of years in the oil field. I was so worried about losing it so I cared much more about protecting my downside than the profit. I knew if I got a good deal and I was really careful and I wouldn't lose, well then there's a shot for upside and I'm safe. And that was my original kind of thesis about don't mess this up, kind of Um. So I just started knocking on doors. You know I look in the appraisal district and see this person owns a lot and I bought a couple dozen lots downtown San Antonio for between five and 10 grand total each. So I was in all of those for a little under like 300 grand. 

06:05
That was like my first real move. I wasn't a buyer or seller, I was a buyer and working in the oil field. That's like how it started. And the first one I actually okay. The first four became a half acre assemblage. Two of them were on market and then the other two are off and I just said let me go buy them. And then the other two are off and I just said let me go buy them. 

06:25 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's funny. So you've always because you've always been like you know the dirty D guy that you like. When people talk about creative real estate, they don't even know what creative real estate is until they hear Logan and how creative he gets with real estate and the different type of things that you do. So even from the very beginning that's just kind of how your brain worked was like I'm going to go do this. Like you didn't even get the help. Instead of going on the MLS, you just found a creative way to be like this is an area of where I want to get homes. I'm going to go talk to the people in the area I want to buy and I'm going to try and buy directly from them. So you were. You were so far ahead of the curve for how long ago that was and how people were doing things, because I was looking for distressed real estate in 2014, 2013. 

07:10
But that was on the MLS, with short sales and pre-foreclosures and stuff like that. Because that Phoenix market got hammered really hard in 2009. Prices went from $400,000 to I mean, it was like 70%. Phoenix and, I know, Vegas were both absolutely imploded because their boom up was crazy like the dot-com bubble in early 2000. So that's just interesting, because I definitely had a little bit different of a journey how to get to distressed real estate. Now owning batch service and batch leads and we specialize in helping people find distressed properties to go direct or even having realtors find, you know, certain type of houses that they want to go after for listings. But to your point you've always been creative and then you've gotten that much more creative. So that's interesting. 

08:00 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I didn't even know that. I hadn't thought about it this way. But now that we're talking I didn't really realize the listing service was as meaningful as it was. This is how basic it was. I thought I want land in this area. I don't know how to get a hold of all these people. I'm going to go to the owner. Like, if you want to buy a car, you go to the dealership or you go to the owner. That's what you do. I did the dealership or you go to the owner. That's what you do. I didn't even think about going to a marketplace. It was a really weird direction at that point. 

08:28 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Now that I think about it that way, shows you're, they got land, I want to go get it from them. I mean, you know, I feel like Texas has always worked a little bit differently. Um, just how you Texans are. And you're just going to go walk up to them, be neighborly, and say, hey, you know what are. And you're just going to go walk up to them, be neighborly, and say, hey, you know what are you doing with this vacant land? Like fixing to put something on it. Or can I fix to put something on it? That's my Texas accent. 

08:56
So, okay, so those are your first few deals, right, oil, trying to grow your wealth a little bit fucked off a bunch of money. When you're younger, uh, luckily, you know you've been clean and sober, I know, for a long time now, and that's actually that's funny is that's pushed me closer and closer and closer and closer to I. I don't really do. I've never really been a drug guy. But you know, the alcohol thing is that has just been lesser and lesser. 

09:22
I actually have like double zero beers in the fridge now to where I don't even have alcohol at the house. I do those and then when I go out to dinner with Aaron I'm down to like one drink and then if I want anything else I'll go to like a non-alcoholic drink. So I've just been so focused on my fitness and, obviously, the personal situation I'm in with a four week old daughter that has that's getting heart surgery, you know, three days from now, I feel like alcohol would be by far the worst thing I could do for myself physically and mentally, and you've been a big part of that. And I just know a lot of people like yourself that are very, very successful, that have just this drive and this. They could just go, go, go and I'm like, how do you do that? And I'm like, well, they don't fucking drink, they don't do drugs. 

10:10 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
You don't have hangovers. Their body is always optimal. 

10:14 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
You know you're never. The only thing you got to focus on is sleep. You know what I mean make sure you're getting sleep and, besides that, your body should be in a good place. Um, so yeah, let's transition. Transition into what, how and what and when did you decide to go from? Okay, this is great to supplement and be a part of kind of my income with the oil gig, and I'm doing this on the side to grow my wealth. What said all right, it's time. 

10:42 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That was some divine intervention About the time I was getting laid off. When the oil business is up and down it's getting a little shaky. And I had a realtor calling off for me about 200 grand off market for one of his builder clients for a lot that I paid like 20 grand for. And I hadn't been watching the market, I just was working and buying cheap and whatever, and his offer to me was 200,000 a minute for 20. And I realized I literally bought it. You could not have timed it better unless you had the sports almanac from back to the future. And I'm swear it wasn't that I was that smart or that sophisticated. There was a lot of luck. I literally bought it. When the curve is like this, like the moment I bought it went this direction. So there was just a lot of luck there. But I sold that particular lot for about $289,000, I remember and that put some cash back in my pocket. I recapitalized two-thirds of that whole portfolio cost with one sale. 

11:40 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's crazy. That's crazy. 

11:41 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
It was a game changer and I realized I'm not a poor oil field hand anymore. I got a couple hundred grand in my pocket, I don't need a job again and I have a bunch of land left. And I thought, if I'm ever going to take a run at like being self-employed, today is the day. So I took a week off, slept, exercised, ate good and, just like you know, decompressed, and then after that week, let's be real, stay dude. 

12:14 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's where it went. That's interesting Cause you know, I guess, what made you this time feel like you could bet on yourself, cause you'd already fucked off a million dollars. Is it just you were sober now and had a different mindset and different self-belief, or cause? I'm trying to unpack a little bit of everything of like you know, I want people there's a lot of. There's going to be successful people listening to this. There's going to be brand new people. I'm just trying to give perspectives, you know, to everyone. But you know, I know you today is Logan the badass, but, like you know, I've had my self doubts too, you know, when I was first getting started. I want people to know that are listening to this, that are getting started, that, um, a lot of people will always say do it sooner, do it sooner, do it sooner, sooner. 

12:48
Luckily, I was in the place to where. You know how I am. I'm just like I'm going to go do something and I just I just did it. Uh, I was already broke and had no money. I had nothing to fucking lose. I'd work at golf club, golf courses. What's the? The worst thing I do is I'm a little bit broker, with a little bit more credit card debt, and go back to serving tables Like I just didn't have anything to lose really besides. 

13:13
I think most people are scared, though is because the one thing that they can lose is, you know, that they have a lot of self doubt and they have a lot of. I don't want to fail Like people just won't do something cause they're scared to let themselves down. Or, you know, let their friends or their circles or their families say I told you so, like you couldn't do this, and I just didn't give a fuck. And I've always been supported by, you know, my family and my friends, and, um, yeah, I've always had a chip on my shoulder too. 

13:42
I graduated, you know, high school with the 2.0 and all my friends were starting to make money. I was, I was 28, 29 when I got into this. So, you know, everyone has their different paths, but my all my twenties I was broke as hell. I don't think I ever had, and you were in a different boat cause you had a good job. You know, I was going on and off to school, I just wanted to party and serve tables and, you know, have uh late night relations with you know young girls in Scottsdale so that that was my jam at the time. 

14:12
But um, I just, I just want people to say it's like, even if you do, if it's not for you, like, the one thing you'll regret later on is that you didn't even try. 

14:22 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
And in my opinion, I do believe that there's some common themes about what you're part of, that kind of origin story in mind. I think they happen on different timelines, but before I got sober and went to oil field, there's a lot of self-doubt. You know, never had more than $1,500 at one time to my name, just fairly similar things to me. Going into the oil field and being sober was a big game changer, more so than the money I earned, because it allowed me to do this job and get positive feedback from my employer. I would get a raise, I would get respect from coworkers, and I never had that. My grades were pretty crummy too because I was always distracted. So, like I never got positive affirmation from those around me in school or any of that. 

15:03
And in the oil field that started to happen and I realized something was actually true. We all a lot of most, almost every human probably tells themselves that you're better, you're worth something, there's something big out for you. Like we, a lot of us all think that, but the problem is you don't believe it until it actually starts to happen. So you feel like you're lying to yourself and you're not sure. And but the oil field started to give me a taste of that. You're good enough, you're actually earning, People are giving you positive affirmation and confidence started to build. 

15:30
So after several years of that and having money in my bank, I'd save the money, not blown it. That was a big new trust. I'm trusting myself. The performance that was a big new trust in myself too. And at that point when I got laid off, I would like there was no more doubt, there was no more question. I was like oh, this is what I'm going to do. It wasn't like is it going to work or not? It was like this is my next move. So personal trust and confidence started to grow. That's when it got to me easy at that time, but I do. I remember saying to other people I should have quit the oil field sooner, but all those things you weren't ready, right Bingo. 

16:08 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
There's a journey for everyone and you know some people it takes a couple months of that self-belief and self-talk to say I'm ready. Some people it could take years. You know I used to always think before having a family that everything was an excuse. I feel very naive now by thinking like that and acting like that, by making assumptions on people and assumptions of their personal life. And it could be a lot scarier to take a risk when you have children to feed and stuff to do or, as you know I'm going through, you know, a personal situation with a sick daughter. You know you can't make moves like that, like all your mental energy is spent somewhere else so you may not be ready. You know to do that and you know I feel like an asshole for like a lot of I don't think I like told people these things but just like me thinking lesser of people for not doing something quick enough or not fully understanding their situation to where I feel like you know going through this, um, you know I've grown up even more and it's the next evolution of you know me um going through experiences to maybe understand. 

17:20
You know people that are in, you know, tough spots with kids or in tough spots with family being sick not just, you know, having a daughter, but having a parent or having this or having to take care of a parent that has cancer like you can't make moves when you're doing those things and I just be like you could do whatever you want and like now that I'm going through it, I'm like maybe not so much the case Like your, your focus and energy is spent on, you know, trying to get someone, someone better, and there's only so much mental aptitude that you could have or spread out. And you know taking risks like that could be tough. So it does need to be the right time, but I think most of the time, to be honest with you, people are pussies and they're just making excuses on you know why, why they're not ready. 

18:07 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I would I would say 80% of the time. 

18:13 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
The other 20% is like oh wow, I get it. That's tough, yeah, no, I agree. But you know, I would say believe and trust in yourself quicker, because you will be like man. It's just that was another year of me not making this money that has changed my life, or not being passionate about what I'm doing. That's making me happier. So I think, do it sooner, but like sooner than later. 

18:35
But all I ask is for you people that haven't done it yet, just do it Like, and I don't care if it's later or sooner, just I hope you eventually do it and follow your dreams and you're not looking back 10, 15 years later with a job or a career that you don't like and saying, man, I wish when I was younger, when I had the time or opportunity or or I was able to take those types of risks because I don't have that family. 

18:57
So if you're younger and you're ready to grind and you don't have that family or kids or serious relationship like this is a time where you should really be like, leaning into self-development and leaning into to learning a craft, um, to where you could have you know all of those things for when you are ready to have a family and wife and kids you can provide. You know the way that you'd like to and I'm very grateful that you know. My family came a little bit later for me but I was so happy that I was in a financial place that I didn't have to worry about all that stuff. 

19:28 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
You know, that makes me think of two things that I believe are very fundamental to the way I think, and I tell these to people a lot. First thing is you're much more capable than you realize and we're just scared for all these different reasons. We're afraid because it's just unknown. So I encourage people and say you're a lot more. You're a lot more capable of things that you don't realize. You've got to go test it and when you test it you might really surprise yourself big time. The other one is you know, I've spent a lot of time understanding and analyzing and figuring out what to do about risk. 

19:58
So when people say I'm going to leave this job and go start a business or I'm going to try this or try that, but they always look at if it fails. It's like they're going to be crucified, thrown off a cliff and burned and everyone's going to hate them. That's not it. The biggest risk they have is the business doesn't work and they have to go out and get a new job again. So they have to step down. But I remind people, y'all are usually fairly successful anyway. 

20:22
Before you go out and do this thing, you got a decent job. So I remember with mine I thought I'm going to start this real estate company, but what if? What if it doesn't work? I knew that I could get on my phone and get a new job in the oil field making 80 or a hundred grand a year within two to four weeks and I thought my downside is so much less than I actually realized until I looked at it. So what, you might be 25, 30 grand behind and then you go get your a hundred thousand dollar job again. Who gives Dude it does? That's like nothing. You'll pay it off in a couple of years and you'll be back to fine. It's not like you're going to get under a bridge homeless, like that's not going to happen. So your downside is a lot less than you think. 

20:58 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, and before we get into kind of no-transcript 60, 70 hours a week your brain if you really want this is going to be consumed. You are going to wake up in the morning. The first thing on your mind is a KPI or a seller you have to call, or a house that you have to Dispo, or a flip that is going right or wrong typically wrong because that's what's going to be on your mind. It is going to consume you if you're getting into real estate and if it's not, you're probably not going to make it. To be completely honest with you, the fruits come when you start having the success. You start learning to become a leader, you start learning to hire and develop talent, and then you start getting a little bit time back unless you're like me, Logan and then add the next thing, and then the next thing, and then the next thing, and I want the biggest real estate software company. 

22:10
Guess what? I still don't have time. My wife and family I still sacrifice some of my time with them because of what I'm trying to do long-term for us and I know you do the same with the traveling and the social media and all the stuff that you have going on, so you can get to a place to where you do have a little bit more time. Me and you have chosen to go to the route of it's, just it's. I think it's our blessing and curse, because it's never enough and we're never good enough, and internally we're never good enough and if we're not in constant motion, we feel like we're failing or falling behind someone else that we look up to. 

22:45 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
He hit the nail on the head, dude All right. 

22:49 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So, logan, I really want to dive into, like your dirty deals, your creative stuff, you know, for someone that's listening or someone that wants to add another tool to their tool belt. I know you've coached quite a few people now I know that you've been. I'm just going to let you take it from here. 

23:06 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Okay, the fun part, the interesting thing, it's cool to talk to and it's got big profits and it's not as hard as people really think if you put a little time into it is a distressed property acquisition. That's kind of what I call it. And when people say it's a foreclosure, that's distress it is. When a house needs some repairs, that's distress it is. But what I really mean is like multiple fighting owners, judgments and liens, breaks in the title chain, like things that cause the typical buyer to not be able to close through a title company, and almost always those properties start to get behind on taxes and it gets to be a really messy situation. Those are the deals that most people throw away and move away from. That's all we touch. 

23:53 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, and let's dive into. You know someone that would be interested in that. And let's say they can't afford coaching or your coaching or your mentorship. Give, give, give a taste of maybe a great place to start, or where can they go? Figure some of this stuff out you know on their own, or you know where would you get started and how. How is it scalable? 

24:13 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
So okay, a lot of pieces to this. I usually don't recommend people go from being a manager, a salesman at Dell computers and jump into distressed real estate. I tell people get into real estate first, figure that out. We don't deal with people that aren't experienced in real estate already, making good side money or full-time doing investing, wholesaling, flipping, whatever. Once you have that familiarity, then it's cake. We've been figured out how to distill what it is we do into just enough skills to buy enough of the messy deals to make a big living. And it's really hard, because it's taken me 10 years to get become an expert at this. But we've been able to dial it down to where, literally in four months we teach people what the deals look like, how to find them and how to think about them and negotiate them, and then we teach them of all of the messy ones out there what's the segment that we can teach you how to understand quickly. Go after that. The remainder of those will become easier over time, but I can get you to make money quick in this. 

25:15 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Right, it's kind of building a pipeline too, because these aren't going to close quickly. These are in escrow for very long periods of time. And you mentioned you have lawyers, private investigators. I guess what are those people that are staffed for you doing? Because obviously someone just getting started isn't going to have some built out team. But I know you make millions of dollars a year doing this so you're able to scale this really unique niche. 

25:39
Which I remember the first time we talked you were coming on the Steve Trang show and you call me and you know I'm still doing a little bit of wholesaling, a little bit of flipping and batches just growing like crazy at that time, and you were like one of the first people that had called me because I was on Steve's like short list of here's other people you need to meet in Phoenix and I was like this dude's, this dude's different, this dude's special. And then I remember making sure that I spent some time and we instantly connected. I mean, we'd only known each other for a couple of years and you were on my short list to my wedding with like was there 40 people there, maybe? So it shows the type of relationship that we have and the type of respect that I have for you. 

26:19 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I appreciate that, dude. You know folks that are already in real estate. I've found that they can actually kind of play around with this stuff a little bit and do better than they expect. But I always encourage people to keep doing what you're doing because that's how you earn money that's stabilized. Don't burn the bridges, Don't abandon that, Keep that going. 

26:40
And a common thread or theme that I found across all of these messy deals that I do they were almost all of them are delinquent on taxes. So in the early days we looked at every single way to like just find the most buried, hidden, unique leads possible. And it gets complicated and I like to make things as simple as I can because it's simple is better, and I ended up finding that a delinquent tax list is one of the best places to shop. Some of those deals won't have ownership and title problems and if you get a layup, good job. But a large part of them have major issues, especially if it's old ownership. 

27:14
And when they do, becoming skilled at negotiating those sellers down low on their price is the heart of all this. You can fix up the property if you want. You can fix the legal issues. You can do all this, but if you enter the property like let's say there's 20 grand behind on taxes and you can get into it for $5,000 above the delinquent tax debt, you're only in it for 25 grand and the property could be worth 100, 200 grand, Like there's a huge Delta there. So getting into it as little as you can means your risk is only limited to the dollars you have out. I'm not going to pay that delinquent tax bill, right? 

27:47
now, I'm going to wait.

27:48
So I'm buying it subject to the delinquent taxes, handing the check for five grand to the seller and then getting entitled. So now I'm an owner. Now I can figure out what other matters I have to deal with where my entry is so low. That way, if I screw up, I'll just let it go to the tax sale and go collect excess proceeds. If I can't fix it, I'll at least break even at the tax sale. So that's a nice downside, like you know, stop loss, so to speak. 

28:13
But a lot of times I recommend folks just get started on a delinquent tax list and, instead of running from a problem when it arises, understand it, ask the title company what to do. Then call a local real estate lawyer and yes, you've got to pay him by the hour and no, he's not going to promise to fix all your problems, but he knows this better than you. So you can start to get information and be creative, stay on it, and a lot of times you can get to that solving it looks way more complicated than it is and people are usually not willing to go deep. Go all in on it. So if you put a little effort on it, you'd be surprised how many home runs you could pull off in your spare time. That's the entry to like. Ease your way into it, in my opinion. 

28:52 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Is really because you could just find good deals in general with tax lingo. We, you know we have that list over at BatchLeads. That's a. That's a list that that we have. That's a list. 

29:02
When I was wholesaling, that was a list that I was constantly hitting. You know, tax delinquent was actually one of my favorite lists. And vacants absentee owner, so like. I would always like to stack those on like, hey, I want a vacant, uh, out of state owner that has delinquent taxes. And those are once you can really start niching down your data and then that's where you could really be. 

29:29
You could have multiple access points of how you're marketing to people like this, because if you do get a hold on these people, they're typically a little bit juicier deals and they're very distressed houses and they can be very distressed situations where you could really help someone get out of a tough spot that just a lot of these people just bury their heads in the sand, don't want to deal with it, and by the time that they come up they're just ready to be done with it. And you know I've people are like you're taking advantage of people, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah and uh, sometimes some people do that, but for the most time, dude, there's times where I just don't want to deal with the problem, to where I know I'm selling something for a really good deal, and I know that Even a rich person will do that. 

30:02
I do it all the time. I do it actually more than I'd like to say I would, because I'm like I don't have fucking time for this. It's like, typically I'll buy something and then I'm too lazy to return it. And then my wife's like, oh, I'll sell it for you on Poshmart or whatever. And I'm like dude, I don't even care enough to do that. 

30:20 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Man. We have bought from folks that are poverty stricken middle class, and I actually did a transaction where I bought a 33% interest from a nationally known urologist out of Manhattan. Like you, Google the dude. He's like as popular as Tom Ferry in herb, I don't know. 

30:36 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, in real estate, yeah, right, so, everybody For sure. 

30:42 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
So you know, let's um let me tell you about the pitch and then I'll tell you about a couple what these deals look like. 

30:49 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Like, yeah, let's do that. I love to see some like real examples. 

30:53 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
My pitch is super low, key low pressure. What I found is when you have these kinds of title problems, the typical wholesaler investor doesn't do them and they hit the easier to close deals, the easier to negotiate. So these kind of get stuck so delinquent tax property that has big title problems. We usually be that way for year over year and I know that and I'm inside the head of those sellers after I've dealt with them long enough. So my pitch is more like look, can you help me understand all these problems I've identified? You might have some ownership by just generally looking at it. Tell me more about what's going on. And they're literally selling me on how bad the problems are, how long they've tried to fix it. Lots of owners their cousin didn't pay their child support so there's a judgment lien against it. We can't find our cousin. He went off to I don't know South America. Never returned. They're like literally telling you how bad it is. So once they tell me how bad it is, I confirm some of that. But I go back to them and I literally offer them like two grand, five grand above the debt owed. And I really helped them understand. 

31:53
Look, I'm not buying this property from you. If y'all were all together and title was clean, then I'd be buying it. I'm simply giving you money to take your seat at the table. You guys this I'm coming to your family's Thanksgiving dinner. This year I got to sit in your seat with all this mess and if I solve it, I get to make some money good money. I'm always honest about that. If I don't, I'm stuck at Thanksgiving with these people you hate for 10 years. I'm there for the next 10 years. I'm just taking your seat at the table. So I don't know if this is going to work. I believe it will, so that's how I understand that. 

32:27 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Uh, we'll definitely clip that part up for you. Um, that's a, that's a great nugget. Um, my next podcast I do in about an hour here I'm going to I'm going to pretend like I'm really good at distressed properties and tell this story as it's my own. So got that going for me. Okay, I think that was actually. That was a huge gold nugget right there. I guess I want to unpack a little bit more. You know, on the personal side of things, and if, if it, if you're not comfortable opening up, that's totally fine. But I guess what I want to go back to, you know, the sobriety part of your life. Um, when, when did you decide to get sober? Uh, what year was that and what really led you to that point? 

33:07 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
so I went into a treatment center in 2012 the first time and I had taken too much at work in the bathroom, basically and you can imagine how that can unravel, yeah, um. So my mom, I went to a treatment facility. You know. I stayed, you know, clean and sober for a little while, um, but it didn't really stick. So I went in and out and my dad got sick and terminal cancer patients they're prescribed the gamut of painkillers. That was my thing, it was the opiates, so I had access to literally anything I could want in any volumes. It was really bad place to be. So that was tough and I'd been. 

33:49
You know, I started using stuff since I was like 16 years old. 15 years old and it starts out soft and easy and a little bit and then it turns into like the monster. But I was freaking sick and tired of it. Man, I was so worn out, just like you made the comment. My friends are buying houses, got jobs, getting married, having kids and I'm living on my fucking friend's couch, dude and paying rent to them and the house they own and I was just like a felt like a piece of shit and the other. 

34:17
This is really bad, to admit, but the drugs stopped working after a while and you have to just take more and more and it gets to the point where they really don't work that well. Compared to what they did 10 years, it didn't work that well. So it was like a. It was like this analysis I just keep loading up on it and it's expensive and run out of money and they don't even work anymore and my life sucks. So at that point I was like I'm going to take a real, honest run at this and I did get sober that time and, thank God, about two weeks after that no, it was about two months is what it was. Yeah, the end of the summer I get this job in the oil field with a friend from school and I got out of the place I was in. I had a decent job, I could finally pass a piss test for the first time in my life and it was just too good to let go of. Literally from two months in. It didn't take long to get better. 

35:05 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's. That's incredible and I'm very proud because I know I know an addiction is, is a lifelong. So you know it's something that you know you'll have to deal with, you know forever, but it's been a long time and I know the type of person you are. So congratulations on that. And the other thing I want to kind of full circle this for, for everyone thinking that you know they're so late on their journeys, I feel like me and you I mean you were what 30 years old when this was going on. 

35:31 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Yeah, so when I finally got, so about 28, 29 yeah, that's what I'm saying. 

35:35 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
I didn't make my first 100 grand till I was 30. Um, you didn't start really being successful till you were in your 30s and I was early to mid when I really started seeing it, because everyone's like you know, there's so many people making so much money that are 18, 21, 25. And you're seeing it because of social media. But someone that's you know, 25, 30, 35. Yo, you could just start your journey. You'd be surprised how fast you could change your life. You could change your financial situation. 

36:00
I almost harp on this on every podcast that I'm doing now is because I experienced it later. I got to see and then you can't be envious of that 18 year old that did it and you didn't do it at 18 or 20. Be proud of them, like, lift them up, be like man. That's incredible. I know what type of person I was and you're not like. That's awesome. Like, everyone has their journey and I wouldn't trade any of the stupid shit I went through all I learned because I'm so much better now and I'm so much more responsible. And thank God I didn't, because I don't know I would have done stupid shit like you. I never really was a drug person. But man, I like to gamble, I like to do some crazy, stupid shit. 

36:47 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
And I could have created some really bad habits for myself that could have been tough to break. How long was it before you started getting serious, like when you left, you know, being a golf pro and stuff from about that time until you first made like big dollars? How many years was that till you were like unsuccessful to like, oh, I'm in the flow now? 

36:55 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
so I think I doubled, like every year. So like I think it was like 29 to 30. My birthday is in November, so my 30th birthday. So that year I think I made it was like 98K or something. I was like a realtor and I was more on the realtor side of things. That first year helping investors find deals, and then that next year I started wholesaling, I think I made like 200. And then I think it went to 400 or it was like 400 to 500. And that next year is like I'm going to, I want to net a mill. Um, so I know I had to do quite a bit of flipping. Um, I really reverse engineered how many flips I have to do, how many wholesales do I have to do. And you know what's my marketing look like? I just had a small team of I had five people in me, so you don't have to to net a million dollars, you don't have to do a lot, or so that'd do a lot four to five years, you were like you were. 

37:45
it was like four, four years dude and then I made a million dollars and that was even before batch dude. So, um, and then, and then I had some really um, you know I was right place, right time with, uh, you know, creating batch skip tracing and batch leads and batch dialer and now batch data as well, uh, in the whole uh product suite for a software company. Um, during that COVID time we had some pinch myself years, I'll say the least, but that million dollars on my own was a big deal for me. I did about 20 flips that were highly profitable, did about 60 to 70 wholesale deals, and this is me owning a company fully on my own, being real creative with my marketing dollars, having a lean little team, and I wasn't even overworked. I was working 40 to 50 hours a week but it wasn't 60, 70 hours a week. 

38:33
You know what I mean. It wasn't, wasn't crazy. Not a lot of vacations, cause you're, I'm operating, the whole thing, um, but at that time I was just really starting to make money, and even a couple of years later, after you really had no money in your bank I'm talking to never have more than three 4,000 bucks, you know and then a bill would come and this would come, um, I was just, you know, and that that was also a horrible part of my life. On the uh, health and fitness wise, I was very unbalanced. I got up to 250 pounds. I was uh, um, my wife is Taiwanese and her, uh, her dad called me Xiao Pompon, which means little chunk. Um, well, I didn't know that until I lost the weight. But he, uh, she'd always like say, he called back oh, how's shout pom-pom, and I was like what, why does he call me that? She's like, oh, it's just a nickname. And then she finally told me when I lost the weight um, let's go yeah, I mean, that was shit 90, 100 pounds ago. 

39:25
so you know I I really worked my butt off on the. You know, I was just so excited to make money, dude, and all I wanted to focus on it. I got so imbalanced it was stupid. 

39:35 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
The reason I asked. That is, I was doing the math in my head and I was about five years in, like I was working hard, you're earning, you're growing, you just don't feel it. Yet All the money's coming through the account. But about that five year mark is about when I was able to make about a million bucks a year too, and we were talking about what it takes to get going. It's not that long, but you do have to give it all. I noticed about the five year mark if people have it and they're really giving it their all and they have a decent business they're working on, not like a like a bad business, within five years, man, you're there and you can decide do I want to take my foot off the gas and just make a million a year, or do I want to, like, make this something massive? It's five years, dude. When you're 80, 90 years old, you're ready to die. Five years doesn't matter. Five years doesn't even matter to me anymore. It's over. 

40:18 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Like, yeah, let's, let's actually unpack a little bit there and talk about that. I want I'll give you my opinion Now, I want yours. Is you know, once you do get there? Um, I just want people to understand is really, when you start hitting that inflection point of, let's say, half a million to a million dollars a year and you've worked really hard to get there Now you have you know, it's probably a small team. Um, small team is sub 20 people in my eyes. Um, and I would say be very intentional. 

40:46
Just because someone else is making a bunch more money and growing and growing, it doesn't actually mean that they're happier or balanced or at a good place in your life. So I would say, you know, be very careful and ask yourself and truly ask yourself, because you'll get to this point, and I know you agree with this is more money does not mean more happiness at all. It doesn't. It's like what is your happiness? And I've came to learn that I think it is. How much money is someone truly happy with spending every month? Do they need the Rolex like Logan has on his watch? That's $60,000? Do they need those things or do they not? Or do they want more family time. Just be very intentional. Do you want the bigger house or can you live on, or do they want more family time? Just be very intentional. Do you want the bigger house, or can you live on $10,000 a month very happily, and then still be making and accumulating all this money on top of it and having a little bit more freedom for yourself and a little bit more time and having a vacation a quarter or doing these things? Or do you want to just keep pushing those limits? Keep pushing those limits? Just understand that every action has an equal and opposite reaction and if you put your time here, you're going to take away time from there, and vice versa. If you put your time into your family and your kids a lot of the time, you're not going to be growing your company. If you keep growing your company, I'm not saying you're neglecting your family, but I'm sure you're not giving them the time and attention that they need. So, just right. 

42:06
I've thought really hard about this. I still haven't found my answer of exactly what I think I want. Because I built a big company, I'm continuing to grow it like I kind of made my bed. I have to go sleep in it right now until batch gets sold, and that could be a couple years from now, it could be 10 years from now. I have no idea what that's going to look like. 

42:26
But I just want people to really think is, when you get to a place to where you're really comfortable, you're really successful and you've done a good job, do you want to keep growing it? And I think, um, with my new found, just how I've really perceived everything is it? It doesn't mean just because you want more balance in your life. I don't look down upon those people anymore. I actually almost envy them to some degree, because it doesn't mean that you're you work hard to get to a place to where you can do these other things that you've really wanted to do your whole life. I shouldn't be like, oh, you're lesser than me because I grew something so much bigger. Everyone has a different purpose and a different why, and be very intentional with that. That was very long winded answer, but it means a lot to me for someone to really think through. 

43:17 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
you know what you want long-term. You know this is like. This is something I didn't identify until just a couple years ago. But my wife and I have had times where she says, logan, you know, you have to give more time to our family, and that sounds really deep. But I work from 7 am to about 5 or 6 pm five days a week. Sometimes I leave early, so I'm not working any more than a regular dude at a job. But and we've had to talk about this sometimes I say, hon, I'm just like I'm working a day job. I'm not all night, all weekend, done that stuff for years anymore. But I started to have to ask myself should I scale back on my hours? Should I spend more time at home? Will I be happier? Will my hat, my family, actually be happier than I'm here more, or will they not? 

43:56
This is just part of an argument that's actually not there not real and I, yeah, through all this like self-discovery, I realized today I'm still trying to prove to my dead dad that I'm good enough, and that sounds crazy wacky and I'll never be able to do that. Obviously Right, but that's the stuff of who I? That's why I have that chip on my shoulder, that's why I feel like I'm always the eternal underdog. And a lot of successful people, you know, it's easy to tell that that's there. So the money thing you know, we still don't even man our household budget. The money thing you know, we still don't even man our household budget. We probably spend 350 grand a year and while that's not nothing, it's, it's not much relative to what we're earning. But my life, I've learned, doesn't get any more satisfying or better, and no one has, frankly, that much better experiences If we lived on a million or 2 million a year, you're just buying a house with better finishes or extra cars, or it doesn't change. 

44:51 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So you run the private jets through the business and don't count that towards the personal right, that's travel expenses. 

44:59 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
But I started to learn like what it is that we need to be happy and satisfied. And why am I doing this? And I understand we have our household budget that probably doesn't grow a ton over time, but this business thing is about me enjoying it. Growing challenging that's what it's about. So when you ask yourself, how long do you do this, do you want to have more balance? Me and my wife have finally come to a place where we like this. She's cool with what I do, I'm cool with what she does and how she feels about it, and we get to exercise the things that make us satisfied. So we'll work forever, dude. I'll do this till I'm dead. I don't care how much I have or don't have. Like this is me. 

45:38 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, but you like I'll counter argue this a little bit. To where I know, you have taken on more conferences. You're doing more social media, so I would argue that you do not work seven five. You're doing more social media, so I would argue that you do not work seven five because you have other stuff. It's also on your mind. And then you're doing social and then you're also doing conferences which take up weekends and there's a lot of planning involved in those. 

45:59
So it's just like, but I feel like that's really filled up your cup for that personal aspect of really being able to pay it forward, help other people. 

46:07
Yes, you have to get paid, paid. I know it's not a huge part of your income, um, it's more of something I feel like that makes you feel good and that's why I'm trying to start to do a little bit more social, because me and you are very similar to where I think we're private and I was so caught off guard when I saw you all over social media. I was like this dude is not a social media guy, or like his personality is not, is not that? And you've done a really good job of just being comfortable in your skin and you're truly good at it. Like you're good, you have good content. I always knew that you know how your you know business mind works was special. So it's like if he's sharing that and he could get really comfortable in front of a camera, you know you're going to resonate to people and you are going to be successful on that side of things. 

46:55 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That resonate to people and you are going to be successful on that side of things. That's a fair point when you look at the way you explained it. You're right, I probably do more than 45 hours a week, but I still think it's really balanced. When my wife and I met, I was working seven days a week, 10, 12, 15 hour days. We barely had time to see each other, so it's now at a place where we feel good about it. 

47:11 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, and you guys have, uh, you've, you've really structured life to have help. But I believe you have a nanny that helps you, because your wife does work too and she's on the realtor side of things and, um, you know that's something that she wants to do and um, that's how she gets all those damn Birkins dude. 

47:27 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
If If she came to me and said Logan, buy all these, it's such an inefficient use of capital, I would jump off a bridge. 

47:35 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, so we discount the $350 a year because whatever she makes in real estate is blown on close. 

47:43 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Yeah, she spends another this is the. 

47:46 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Let's not even do the math, because it will make her mad. Honestly, my wife has a lesser problem than yours, um, but I would say you know, if this and you've explained to that your wife really came from nothing, from a third world country, and you know this is what makes her feel good and feel special, and as long as it's not, you know, anything egregious and it's money that she's making, um, totally cool with that. 

48:13
Let her go do it and I kind of let my wife do the same thing. I like shake my head. I'm like this is this is like $20 worth of leather that you're spending five grand on. But have fun, that's same we also. You also have a very expensive watch on your hand and, uh, I'm pretty sure your Apple watch could tell the same time as your Rolex. 

48:31 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
So that's the one splurge I did this last year. We both bought really nice new cars. That's something new for us, yeah. 

48:39 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
I saw that.

48:40 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I got that same week. I got two same thing, One for her, one for me. 

48:46 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Well, I remember talking to you when we first met and you were like no-transcript, are you doing? 

49:21
Um, you know, like I'm really good at investing my money and I know you love to reinvest your money too, but at the same time, like what's really important to me is like you know what am I going to be in every day? 

49:30
I'm going to be in you know car every day. I'm going to go home to a house every day and I really want to have a really nice house and you know I love to entertain and have people around me and create experiences at my house. So I've spent a lot of money on updating my house and remodeling my house and having a. I don't do a ton of vacations either, so it's like I love people to come to me and I want to have an immersive experience for to create memories you know at. You know at my house, and everyone kind of spends it differently, but you weren't spending at all and I was like yo, brother, like please enjoy some of the fruits at least, and I feel like you've done a good job doing that too now, well, the ease in that direction, the watch you know you commented on. 

50:10 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That was after a banger of a deal. We bought a warehouse and flipped it and doubled our money. So we bought it for a million and a half, sold it for three or a little above and I called the watch guy. I was like man, this is when covid was half the prices were super crazy high on watches and I called him and said this is what I want to show to a picture like this is the exact one he goes. I can get it, no problem. I said this is what I want to show to a pitcher Like this is the exact one he goes. I can get it, no problem. I said okay, this deal closed, I want it Showed one of the one of the. 

50:33
I had two partners on that deal with me here in the office. I showed one of them and he's like you're really going to get that? I'm like is what world am I in? So then we call the watch guy and I said hey, man, remember that watch I wanted. He's like yeah, like I was going to back out and I said I need three. 

50:59 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's funny. That's why, yeah, I mean I, I did the same thing. Um, it was like a big deal or big event or something right now I got the you know daughter's wristband to get into the hospital going um, but mine was actually different. Uh, it was when we're really doing absolutely fantastic at batch. 

51:18
mine was um when I got under 200 pounds, uh. So I had to lose 50 pounds and I got a rose gold, uh sky dweller and that was covid peak. I paid, including tax, like $72,000 for $50,000 watch and that was hard to stomach, but I wanted what I wanted. I'd been overweight for a long time when I was younger. I was not overweight, I wasn't quite in the shape that I'm in today, but I played sports. I was always reasonably fit and I was never a couple months away from being very fit and it was. It was really hard for me to get under 200, cause I just did. It was a journey and I still was working a ton and batch was growing like crazy. 

52:01
So you know, I think I got to like.

52:05
I think I got to like 202 and ordered it, but I was. I was under 200 when I got it. 

52:09 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I remember 200 was like I got to break this. I got to like 202 and ordered it, but I was under 200 when I got it. I remember 200 was like I got to break this, I got to break this. Now you've shredded that number. That number is like a joke at this point. 

52:16 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Well, that was just the first step. But, like I promised myself like the first time, like no Lamborghini until I lost some weight and I just went and bought the Lamborghini, I was like okay, no, and I wanted the Rolex so bad because that meant something so much to me. Because I weirdly subconsciously, had always looked up to my uncle and he'd always some uh, he's a car dealership, owned a car dealership from Chicago, just real old school, old school guy, and you know, I just always looked at he was kind of that successful person I always look up to and he always had had a Rolex on. So I think it just got ingrained in me and that was just like something that. That that's kind of the I mean Rolex has done a great job and all these luxury watch brands is, you know, when people get somewhere in life, this is how they want to, you know, celebrate their success. 

53:04 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
You know, when I saw that rose gold, I remember looking at that thing and I I'm not like a big jewelry guy so I don't know all that. But I remember looking at saying man, that's a cool color. How did it end up being off like that? That's neat. And then I said and then you said rose gold. And I didn't want to say I don't know what that is. So I went and Googled it afterwards I'm like, oh shit, okay. 

53:32 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That's funny. I love the way that looks. That's a cool one. So let's, let's jump into. I want to kind of we've been off topic, but that's what podcasts are for. Let's discuss today. You know what's your outlook, what are your goals, what's your aspirations for the future and what's guiding you know principles for you. 

53:45 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
You know, early on I don't know that I felt like I looked at principles or core values. Although they existed, I hadn't really understood what they were and what they meant. We just did business, we're honest and worked hard. That was what guided us and try to make as much money as possible and I would do business with the shadiest, nastiest loser, bad people, because there was an opportunity. I'm going to go make the money. And over time, I started to realize that you got to stay away from bad people. Just because it's a massive deal, it doesn't mean it's something you need to be in. It might not actually fit your organization. 

54:17
All these really healthy metrics actually started to creep into our company, but I had to get enough money to like I had to get over this hump before I really spent time focusing on it and we started to find that. You know, we wrote out our core values with this exercise and realized that they do guide everything. We do all our decisions, Even if a person has to be fired. I never understood. We fired them because they don't match our core values. Well, if productivity and integrity the core value yeah, their core values. So if they're not very productive and very honest, dude, they don't fit here. But figuring those things out really helped us understand who we are. And today our office has 20 people in it, including me, and it's a big enough company where we can be very productive, but it's not so big where I'm managing this massive thing. You know I don't like that and it's. It's become a really neat place where everybody, yeah, Like dude, you have a lot of headcount. Man, that sounds tough. 

55:15 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
The trick with that, honestly, is having a great leadership team underneath you, and then there's leaders you know everywhere. If you, if you do it the right way, I'm really only managing a couple people and they've done an incredible job and they inspire their team. Like I'm not the leader to a lot of these people in these specific pods, it's the people that they're interacting with every day, or whoever's heading the department, so it's just different. Obviously, problems always rise up, I suppose, especially the big ones, but I wouldn't change it in the world, because it's something I'm very grateful that I've got to experience and learn it in the world, because it's something I'm very grateful that I've got to experience and learn. And you know, if we're to grow again or if I were to do it again, I know a lot of more of what not to do, even more than what to do you know that there's a there's a bottleneck that a lot of people experience and they never can make it through. 

56:03 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
It is hiring people and trusting them to do the job and getting out of their way, and a lot of people who start businesses think they should do everything and that is a huge growth restriction. And that was one of the things that I remember when we were talking. You made comments like that and I admired that, because it doesn't sound like that hurdle was even in your vocabulary or existed with you. Maybe it did, and I don't know, but you move right through that building, growing, training, assigning and just letting it take its life of its own, whereas there are times where I struggled with that. 

56:38 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So I think that's a huge trait that is underrated, but you guys are really good at it. I mean, I'm definitely I could be self-aware enough to know, um, there's, my strength is probably EQ. Um, I am smart, but there's a lot of people smarter than me, and what I learned quickly, especially getting into software where I didn't know anything about it? Obviously, I understood what needed to be built for a real estate investor or real estate agent, but how to market to them, how to sell software, how to package software I needed to hire people that had the experience and that were smarter than me in these places. Yes, I could learn it and, yes, I needed to hire people that had the experience and that were smarter than me in these places. Yes, I could learn it. And, yes, I still learn from a bunch of my employees all the time, because they've been in the space for a lot longer than I have. And the thing I'm most proud of is like having and my partners too is like we want to hire people that are smarter than us or else they're just order takers. Like I want people to make impact. I want our employees to feel like they have a voice and they have ownership and they have this great idea that is going to be implemented quickly, because we're not saying we're better than you do, we're all a part of the team. 

57:40
My job is to put the best players on the field. 

57:50
I look at myself, you know it's like you know the owner, or you know the GM or whatever of you know a pro sports team is like. 

57:53
Obviously, the owner is you know the box that I'm in, but even owner gm a better version of jerry jones is what I like to think myself, as is like my. My real focus is is making sure that every thing is, is operating proficiently and everyone's rowing in the same direction, because I have a ton of people around me that are so much smarter than me and so much more experienced and stuff to where I'm just trying to make sure everything's firing on all cylinders. That's more where my focus is is is the guiding principles, the long, the long-term uh roadmaps and what we're really trying to do, and then and then the thing that I self-cont self contribute the most is the relationships and finding opportunities of collaboration. That's where all my time spent. 

58:35
It's not, it's not anywhere else, and I'm doing a disservice to the organization If I'm trying to let my sales leader, my marketing, uh, head of marketing, tell them how to do job better, cause if that's the case, they shouldn't be there, right, yeah, you're right if that's the case, they shouldn't be there, right? 

58:53 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Yeah, you're right. So I'll tell you what. We get derailed because we have such a relationship, but let's talk about some deals, okay. So I ran a report in December. I need to run it again. 

59:07
At that time we have multiple companies under this umbrella that I'm going a share of each one. I've helped capitalize and train and grow and nurture. But one of the companies in-house that reports that they had 82 properties in inventory. Either we own 1% or 100% somewhere around there. Wow, our cost basis was $4.5 million. Well, I'm sorry, 4.5 million. Well, I'm sorry, we have 3 million in actual cost basis and forecasted 1.5 million more to go to own all of it or cure the title defects. So forecasted 4.5 million in total cost basis. They ran a fair market value report and we were at 12 million in property value. So that's about seven and a half million in equity on a four and a half million dollars spent. 

59:49
That's what that particular entity looked like, and this is the wild part, dude. So that's about seven and a half million in equity on a four and a half million dollar spend. That's what that particular entity looked like, and this is the wild part, dude, back five, six years ago we were really just trying to figure all this out. Our cash conversion cycle is 12 to 18 months. It took that long to clean these up, but we saw the problems in running a business with such a slow moving conversion cycle. So we actively decided to say kind of, put this into play, guys. If it's too messy and it's going to take years and years, don't do it Now. You want just enough title problems, ownership problems to negotiate a good deal, but not so big that it's like years. Right now, dude, our cash conversion cycle is between 120 and 150 days. Wow, I can clean up a title as fast as I don't know. 

01:00:38 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That purple haired dude can flip a freaking house man like bam so you're starting, though, to walk away from some of this crazy messy ones that you used to take on. We just kind of changed, I guess, your messy deal box let's call it of all right, because you know how long something's going to take or not take. You've done hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of these, so now it's just like I just don't want money tied up this long in the situation. You could let the new Logan that's five years behind you go deal with those. Now is what you're talking about. 

01:01:12 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Yeah, there's still some deals that I'm willing to buy into. We bought 50% of a marital estate community property. All the real estate combined is $7 million. We bought 50% of that for $20,000 from a really angry spouse. Yeah. 

01:01:28 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Yeah, there's exceptions, I suppose, to the rule. Like that I could see that you know. 

01:01:33 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That one. We're going to let that marinate for a couple years and then we're going to file a lawsuit. So I'm just sitting on it. But for $20,000, I'll do that, but that's not the norm. We have a category of those, but otherwise we want something that can move quicker. So that makes a big difference. So the reason I started with that is currently our cash conversion cycle is less than six months, which is monumental, considering 12 to 18 months was the old one. Also in this report I did the average of assets, the price, and I found across the trailing 200 deals our average exit price was $194,000. So let's call it 200. Our average entry was $48,000. 

01:02:22 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So how much was there in lawyer and all those fees in between? 

01:02:25 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That's our well. I should have said differently. Our total cost basis per deal was 48,000. 

01:02:30 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So that's legal fees. So you're making like 150,000 bucks pop on these. 

01:02:33 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That's gross. But after you do our overhead, expenses, commissions and all that kind of stuff, we were at a one. That's gross profit 150 ish, 152. 

01:02:43 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
I know what gross profit is. 

01:02:46
I'm kidding for the audience.

01:02:47
Yeah, gross profit is top line, and then he's netting everything out. I don't think we need to get that granular I'm sure it's in the six figures. 

01:02:54
Net was 125 yep, bam, that's incredible. That is incredible, truly. I don't even know what to say because I'm like that's, that's a lot of money, especially for that. Uh, many deals, let's, let's pivot to. Um, you know, before we wrap up, I also want you to kind of dive into. You know, quick, not, we got plenty of time. Um, I have 18 minutes before my next one. I know we're over on this, but my point being is you know what? What's your biggest goals, aspiration? What's driving you? What's logan going to look like? You know, from 25, 26, 27, like what do you? I know I have a good idea, but I want the audience to know and I also I'd love to hear your perspective of what like your real big goals, aspiration, like what are you really trying to focus on over these next couple of years? 

01:03:44 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
You know, now the businesses have been built where they're. They're running really, really well. The managing partner that runs them is real man. Each managing partner now has been with me for four to six years. Their companies are efficient. They got the capital and the credit they need. They know what they're doing. 

01:03:58
Right now they're working on their teams and I'm watching their profits really look good and their operations really do well and, frankly, I'm not doing a lot of it. I'm watching this go and I get. I can answer some questions that have a little bit of interaction. But, dude, these guys are now flexing. They are stretching their arms and flapping their wings. This is incredible to watch them just grow and prosper. And naturally, you know I've got a share of them, so I do too, but this has been great. So this year I'm like, hey, let me work on the social media, let's do some coaching. Um, that's kind of where I've headed. But the big business line that I really am enjoying developing is the land development. You can move the needle, I mean, between three transactions. It's just a little under $100 million in pipeline value right now. That's 1,100 lots, 250 lots, 350 lots. Just that there is massive. 

01:04:55 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
So I'm trying to funnel efforts that direction outside of the coaching and the internet, and I feel like the thing that you've done really well, especially with this land stuff and this may just be, you know, the Texas boy in you is you're willing to to give investors a good deal to raise quickly and not have to worry about that to where it's like, hey, I find stuff really deep and really good. I'm going to, I'm going to eat, I want you guys to eat too, and then it just makes it as you continue to grow this thing, that or this pipeline of land that, if you're showing this, this crazy track record, I mean you're going to, you know, be the Warren Buffett of real estate land to where it's like people are begging to get into your deals. And you know I remember bitching about not putting enough money in the last deal I got into. I'm like there's no more and you're like, sorry, dude, like this, this went quickly. 

01:05:44
So and I know I'm going to have the opportunity to roll some of my proceeds from this project that we're working on now that hopefully should close this year sometime. I believe that should be a healthy profit. I don't want to get into what those profits look like, but they're better. I'm in multiple syndications and multiple deals, this is by far the most lucrative one, if your projections iron out. So I'm really excited to see what that looks like and I'm really excited for you, because I know that you are, you know, on on both sides of the deal, to where you are putting your money in there as well. Um, and that's how much you believe in the deals, and it looks like, from the team that you put together and who I've talked to, that you have something another thing to tap into that's very, very scalable. Oh my gosh. 

01:06:31 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
Yeah, you can do a 250 lot deal and operationally it's the same as a 1200 lot deal, it's just less dollars. But as you start to get comfortable with it and know how it works, yeah, dude, wow, it's really interesting. I think to your point about giving good deals. You know, I've never been a greedy guy. I've always tried to be fair. And there are some guys their average investor nickels and dimes everybody the seller, the lawyer, the contractor. They fight with title companies because they want lower escrow fees. That's so fucking exhausting. But also, no one likes you. Like, if you're that dude that fights everybody. But by doing it this way, people always answer my calls, they are always ready to play ball. I am never at a loss for resources of any kind and it just means you can move fast and move better. So for me, paying people what's fair? It just gives you more strength and authority to go do what you got to do. 

01:07:32 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
I know. But, like for people that are getting into syndicating and people that you know, cause I am an investor and stuff like that, cause I'm focused on the software, so like I get to look at a few deals, quite a few deals. A lot of people call me, pitch me. They know that I've had success and, as I continue to do, more social people know that I do have access to, you know, my own capital to deploy into deals. And the thing that you know bugs me the most is everyone tries to come in with like hey, you're, you're, you know, ir, you're. 

01:07:57
You know your early return is going to be between 12 and 18 percent, like that's every deal. That's like you being a wholesaler and just offering the same price or you know not being creative at all, and then they nickel and dime all these fees. So it's like, like the questions that I ask is like, do you have any of your own money in the deal and what type of fees are you guys charging for? You know acquiring the property, selling the property, um, what are you charging for? Managing? You know all the management fees. And if they have all these outrageous fees, they actually don't give a shit what it sells for Cause they're making all their money and all the fees. 

01:08:30 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
That's why I've always hated typical syndications unless you have a mega baller operator, because they're getting paid along the way and while I'm not and people got to make a living, I get it. But when you're milking that deal, I've seen people lose money on the syndication but they made a bunch of management fees along the way. It's wrong. It's just wrong, and people don't value other people's cash like their own and every dollar we've ever taken in as far as private investment, I always looked at it as it was my own and I've always been able to tell myself it. Let's say, Jesse called me and said I got a life emergency, I need my money and I'm like dude, we got 12 more months until we get paid out. If I have that kind of capital laying around and I have the ability, I always wanted to feel comfortable taking anybody's piece out If it was like life or death your deals are good enough to, or I'm someone would take. 

01:09:17 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
If you let like someone transfer it to someone else or sell it at, say, face value, you know what I mean. If someone's just like hey, I need my money back. Um. 

01:09:25 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
I'd happily take anybody out. So when I put myself in your shoes and Tim's shoes and Georgia's shoes and all those guys, and if it was good enough for me to take that piece, I'm like, all right, it's good enough for them too. 

01:09:36 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Right and I can agree more, but I that's like that's the first thing uh, learning anything from you know, investing into other people's deals? That's my first question is looking at their free schedule and fee structure. Uh, do they have money in the deal? Is my next question. Um, and to be completely honest with you, I'm going to have my team underwrite the deal. Um, they're going to underwrite you as an operator as well and ask a ton of questions because I have a whole team around me, because I will get excited and want to do things. And they're like nope, you, they have to go through us too. Um, as you had to. Um as well. And they call me with this deal and they're like what's wrong with it? They're like tell me something, this is too good. And I'm like this is my boy, like I'm telling you it's good. You're the only deal that I brought that they've accepted, by the way, and I probably bought them like 12 deals. I mean I could choose to spend my money as how I see fit. 

01:10:35 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
But that's kudos, you know to you. But you know I just if I want to have a meeting with them at Christmas, cause we should be all exited and tax returns and all done by then I would love to talk to them about afterwards. 

01:10:41 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
That'd be cool, Cause that's a yeah, and you just don't have a problem raising money to where you know. I want to invest in there to where you know, cause they could open up if you ever get really, really big deals or if you go further along. They would be good to tap into because they manage 100 of me, just FYI, so that could be interesting. But yeah, if it's not more than 20% and the deal doesn't look really good and if the fees are anywhere middle of the road towards outrageous, I'm just not interested, because the person that's doing this deal does not give a shit about what they exit for and you getting your return. They just don't, and I hate that. Everyone is just like well standards, 15% a year, 14% or 12%. I'm like dude, I go lend hard money and get money on that every day. And then the other question is how much depreciation can I get to help offset my taxes? That's a whole nether thing, but, um, that is my rant. I hope someone gets some value out of there. 

01:11:37
If you are very successful listening to this and you are looking to invest into real estate syndications, um, those are some of the things that I would definitely look into if and underwrite yourself if you do not have a team like I have, but I'm also doing some of that underwriting. You know myself as well and, before we wrap up, this has been this has been super fun. This has definitely been the most off the cuff uh podcast I've done so far, which shows the you know comfortableness that we have with each other. But I know that a lot of people um, I just want to say if you're interested in doing, if you're in real estate in your full time and you're interested in doing dirty deals or adding another tool to your tool belt, logan is definitely the pioneer in this side of things. 

01:12:22
How can someone reach out to you? How can someone work with you? How can someone follow you? You are an incredible human, you're an incredible operator and the more people that learn about you that's one of my mission is. I love being around people that have the same values that I have and you definitely align with those. So how can people get ahold of Logan Fulmer? 

01:12:42 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
If you go to Instagram and just type in Logan Fulmer, you'll find a website, several social channels. Don't put it into Google and you can't miss it. 

01:13:01 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
A lot of easy ways to access Send me a message, dm, email, it's all out there. So, logan Fulmer, I love it, and before we go, I do this every podcast, give me an advice. I want some advice for an entrepreneur. It doesn't have to be real estate, it doesn't. It could be any part of their journey. 

01:13:11 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
And then I also want to know a book that's truly impacted you or changed your life. 

01:13:12 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Those are the last two things I need from you. 

01:13:14 - Logan Fullmer (Guest)
How to win friends and influence people. Great book Love that one, and I touched on this a little bit earlier. But I want to remind people that they're capable of much more than they believe and I encourage them to go test that and try that. And maybe if you're afraid to bite off something huge, that's okay, do it a little bit. Take that risk, take that chance, go test something out, because a couple wins in a row will help open your eyes and you'd be so surprised what's out there waiting for you on the other side of that fear. 

01:13:47 - Jesse Burrell (Host)
Couldn't wrap it up any better way. Thank you everyone for joining another episode or podcast of the property perspective. Logan, I appreciate you coming on and until next time let's get it. 

01:14:01 - Hope (Announcement)
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